A few months ago, my wife and I visited a unique farm and community in rural Thailand, called PunPun. It was founded by city worker turned farmer, Jon Jandai. It was his TEDxTalk several years ago, seen millions of times, that inspired us to go. The bulk of our time on site was either related to building mud huts or tending to my upset stomach :) 



However, as karma would have it, a few months later I’m seeing Jon on the other end of my Skype screen, with more expansive time to ask him questions about his approach. I was especially intrigued to probe, as despite being inspired from an online link, I had actually found very little about him online. What follows is a recap of our conversation this past week. What I couldn’t capture was the tone of the call – laughter throughout and very light :)

The way he is portrayed to the world is as a farmer who believes in simplicity, and yet as we dove deeper, I found that was (unsurprisingly) the tip of the iceberg…



Q: What is your relationship with ‘inner development,’ meditation and so on?
Jon Jandai (JJ): There are 2 ways to think of what is happening internally. One is reactivity to feelings, the other is consciousness. Most of us are constantly moved by feelings – moving away from dislikes, grasping for what we like. And we suffer a lot. Focusing on consciousness, the focus can’t help but shift, towards mission and calling.

We’re looking for a right relationship. If I want an iPhone, I can check myself and see if I need it as a farmer. Or is it to satisfy my liking? However, if I’m a stock broker, the same iPhone may actually be a ‘need’ rather than a ‘like’! It’s OK to me to use these things, just use with consciousness.

Q: How to share this perspective of growing in consciousness with others?
JJ: Consciousness cannot be shared with others, we can only train ourselves. If anybody wants to change, they can change themselves. Then, perhaps one day someone might say ‘oh I want to be like this person….’

Q: How do you train yourself in this inner path?
JJ: I practice simple things, to not follow my reactivity towards likes and dislikes. For example, I used to like ice cream. Then, I went to Swensons and bought ice cream for all my friends and just sat down and watched them eat. And I paid attention to myself. I saw craving and desire was rising up. I was just watching, and then I saw the desire go down also and went away. I am learning to be patient – its not that bad to not eat ice cream!

I do it with fear also. Given my cultural background, I have had some fears regarding ghosts. So I went to the cemetery, and spent time there. My fear told me to run, I dislike it here. But instead I just stayed and watched myself. Ups and downs have decreased over time – they are not gone for me, but they don’t control my life so much anymore.

We create problems from nothing, only our mind and feelings are changing, creating new fear and worries! But just by watching it, we can have a new ‘normal’

Q: What is your relationship to charging and using money?
JJ: Charging is quite a normal activity in life. Financial sustainability seems to require it. Charging with too much profit creates issues. For us, that means being in relationship with people. We work with farmers – we train them to be organic, and we pay them for their survival and needs. Then we have produce that we sell in the market, we use a cost+ model, 20-30% ‘profit’ that we use to run our programs. But we make sure that price is still something most everyone can buy. And we use the profit for our farm needs and survival, and we keep asking ourselves how to live like that.
If you have more than you need, then you give to others without expecting in return. We call this ‘dana’ [BP- Dana is a Sanskrit/Pali term referring to unconditional financial giving. As Thailand is 90% Buddhist, this is a well-known term].

Feeling that ‘we own money’ is a garbage of the mind, and harder to get change than the garbage of the world. When I stop following the rules of money, I get more energy and joy in life.

Q: How do you think about what some call the major global crises currently in the world (eg, inequality, climate change, etc)?
JJ: This is a time of the last straw on the camels back. Multiple collapses of systems may be coming soon. First environmental, which we are already seeing. Second is economy. People are not asking ‘where does money come from?’ only ‘where do I get more money?’ There are 2 places money may be coming from-
1-Processing of natural resources of the earth
2-Processing of cheap labor, or human resources

Its much harder to focus on creating new resources on the earth – regeneration. Without this, humanity won’t last. The problems of the earth are due to our thinking, and they cannot be solved easily.



Q: How are you continuing to develop on our journey at this time?
JJ: I am asking myself how do I learn to follow the will of consciousness. No more slave to like and dislike. Most important thing in life is to understand my mind and myself.

Q: Given your life direction both in the world and in yourself, how do you think about the role of relationships and marriage [BP: Jon himself has a partner, Peggy]?
JJ: Living a life driven by consciousness can make everything more relaxed. It leads to less conflict. Like and dislike leads to conflict, surrender leads to easy :)

Q: Any final words to share with the broader community and myself as the questioner?
JJ: There is nothing serious on this earth. Don’t be afraid of anything, just do what you like. And grow in your own understanding of consciousness, don’t be controlled by your likes and dislikes.

It is actually dangerous, to study and remember, but not understand through practice. Then I think I know, but actually not the case, and even harder to grow.

This is religion too! But we study too much, and not much practice. You should do it, not read too much about it :)